Part 1 - Breaking the Silence on Men's Mental Health

Is acknowledging mental health struggles actually a sign of strength? Amid the pressures of entrepreneurship, executive roles, and family responsibilities, we often overlook the profound impact mental health has on men's lives. 

In this episode, I open up about my personal journey through depression after a major life upheaval, illustrating the importance of mental well-being alongside work and family responsibilities. We tackle the cultural norms that deter men from seeking help, redefining stoicism as a healthy expression and mastery of emotions, and encourage breaking the stigma surrounding mental health.

We also explore the evolving norms of masculinity, focusing on how men express affection and vulnerability. Whether it’s the growing acceptance of hugging friends or the challenges of being a stay-at-home dad, we highlight the emotional growth in men today. Through personal stories and practical advice, we emphasize the crucial need for men to communicate openly and seek support. 

Finally, we address the pressures of balancing professional success and personal life, using real-life examples like John, a successful entrepreneur whose mental health journey underscores the importance of balance and self-awareness. Join us for a thoughtful discussion that aims to uplift and empower men in their journey towards better mental health.

Key moments in this episode:

03:59 Breaking the Stigma Around Men's Mental Health 
04:44 Cultural Norms and Stoicism
07:25 The Fear of Judgment
16:12 Levels of Emotional Intimacy
19:36 Challenges of Entrepreneurs and Executives
24:23 John's Story: A Journey to Mental Health
28:24 Practical Tips for Mental Well-being
30:05 Conclusion: Prioritize Your Mental Health

Chapters

• 0:00 Men's Mental Health Stigma and Awareness
• 9:17 Men's Emotional Expression and Intimacy
• 20:30 Navigating the Pressures of Masculinity

Transcript

Speaker 1: 0:00

You know, as entrepreneurs, executives and family men, we face unique challenges that can take a toll on our mental well-being. And, despite our successes, it's easy to neglect our mental health and thinking that we may need to be stronger and invincible all the time, but the truth is, acknowledging and addressing our mental health is a sign of strength, not weakness, and so, in this series that I'm about to explore with you on the importance of mental health, I want to share some practical tips, provide resources and help you navigate the pressures of work and family life. And this isn't just about managing stress, my friends. It's also about thriving in all areas of your life.

Speaker 1: 0:39

And before we get into all that, you know that being a man today has never been more challenging, and so the pain we feel is real. It's a pain of loneliness and a pain of unworthiness, and that's masked by your anger and our resentment. It's all because we are uncertain and afraid to take that next step. So if you're tired and fed up with where your life is at, I'm going to encourage you to start your hero's quest. It's where you can become more, accomplish more and live more than ever before. Just go to membersthewakenmannet and start your quest today, and with that, let's get on with today's episode.

Speaker 2: 1:15

The average man today is sleepwalking through life, many never reaching their true potential, let alone ever crossing the finish line to living a purposeful life, let alone ever crossing the finish line to living a purposeful life. Yet the hunger still exists, albeit buried amidst his cluttered mind, misguided beliefs and values that no longer serve him. It's time to align yourself for greatness. It's time to become a revolutionary man. Stay strong, my brother.

Speaker 1: 1:44

Welcome everyone to the Revolutionary man Podcast. I'm the founder of the Awakened man Movement and your host, alan DeMonso. Today, we're kicking off a special four-part series on a subject that's crucial yet often overlooked, and it's men's mental health. And so let me start by asking you a couple of questions for you to think about your own mental health. First, what does mental health actually mean to you, and how often are you prioritizing it? Second, have you ever felt overwhelmed by the pressures of work and family, and, if so, how did you cope? See, the statistics show a really telling story, in that the suicide rate is four times higher for men than it is for women, and the kicker is that we usually continue. We actually end up by finding out that it's actually been misdiagnosed, and with depression and mood disorders, and so I want to talk a little bit about my own personal journey and my personal story, about what that was like.

Speaker 1: 2:45

And you see, 25 years ago, after being married to my high school sweetheart for almost 15 years, our life ended, our whole marriage and everything fell apart. It forced me into a position of bankruptcy, and through all of that losing everything and losing my family I found myself in a state of deep depression. Now, I didn't recognize it at the time. I just felt that this heavy weight was sitting on my shoulders, and it took a while for me to realize that this was something that I needed to actually deal with, and so I started to work towards finding a better, healthy idea about who I was as a man, towards finding a better, healthy idea about who I was as a man. And then, because that whole downfall was because of how I had misguided priorities in terms of my career and how much I had displaced my family, and so we can have these issues in our lives as men, we can find ourselves in these positions where we prioritize certain things, thinking we're doing the best things for ourselves and our families.

Speaker 1: 3:45

The truth of the matter is that when we put all our eggs in one basket like that, we can come across a crossroads that is very difficult for us to traverse, and so I want to dive into the core of today's episode, and it's about breaking the stigma around men's mental health, and so the stigma and the importance of us really understanding these two pieces, and so that many men feel the need to put on this brave face. I felt that to do that is that I couldn't show that I was struggling, and so I hid that from my wife, I hid that from my family and from many people, and so society often tells us that showing that we're struggling is a sign of weakness. But this couldn't be further from the truth. And so society often tells us that showing that we're struggling is a sign of weakness. But this couldn't be further from the truth, and so I want us to be able to discuss mental health today openly, so we can break down these barriers, encourage even more men to seek the help that they need.

Speaker 1: 4:40

So I want to really unpack the idea of stigma around mental health, and I'm going to start by really having us look at the cultural norms that exist today. And so, you know, in many cultures and communities we place a high value on stoicism and self-reliance. You know, I think of Emerson's essay on self-reliance, and that's as men are keys to how we see and perceive ourselves in life. This cultural norm can deter us, as men, from really seeking the help that we need. And so let me start off by addressing the idea of the stoicism, and to me, stoicism is not about discouraging emotional expression. Instead, it's about recognizing our emotions and displaying them in a healthy way. Instead, it's about recognizing our emotions and displaying them in a healthy way, and it's really about us becoming masters of our own emotions. And so it takes me back to thinking about a quote by Aristotle. Here's what it says.

Speaker 1: 5:34

It says To feel these feelings at the right time, on the right occasion, towards the right people for the right purpose, and in the right manner Is to feel the best amount of them, which is the mean amount, and that best amount is, of course, the mark of virtue. So all that Aristotle is saying there is that it's okay for us to have these feelings and these emotions, and it's really about how we express them and how we lean into them. And for many of us men, we haven't been taught how to do that, and so we either stuff it, which gives us the idea of the stoic idea of not being able to express, or we haven't had any emotional maturity. The other side of that spectrum, I should say, is really about, then, overexpressing it. That's where anger and rage come from, and when we haven't learned to balance those pieces, then we tend to struggle, and so we choose not to express ourself. And, yes, this does mean that it's okay for us to be angry, but no, it doesn't make and that doesn't make you a toxic person, as many would like us to believe today. But having uncontrolled emotions, I'm talking about how do we feel and express, really understand these emotions? Because when we can do that, we can remove that stigma that we carry for ourselves and we can start to move forward with our lives. And so I look at a study published by the American Journal of Men's Health, and they found that traditional masculine norms significantly contribute to men's reluctance to seek mental health treatment, and I think that there's a lot of truth in that.

Speaker 1: 7:14

I think there's a challenge for us, as men, to truly understand what it means to feel into our emotions. And so what's the next piece of that? And why don't we want to do it? Because for many of us, as we were growing up, there was this fear of judgment in our lives, and men often fear being judged because when we are, it makes us feel that we're weak or we're incapable, especially if we admit that we're experiencing a mental health issue, and so this fear can really prevent us from opening up to friends and to families and to other professionals. We learn at a really young age as boys that when we can't do something, we're going to be judged.

Speaker 1: 7:55

You know, as I was preparing for today's episode, I saw this Reddit question that this user posed, and his question was what shouldn't men be judged doing? And while there's a whole list of things on there, there's a few that really I thought were really interesting ones, so I'm going to list them out for you. So what shouldn't men be judged for doing? Not knowing how to fix something.

Speaker 1: 8:18

You know, I was over at a good friend's place this past weekend and he's mechanically inclined and he's an outstanding carpenter.

Speaker 1: 8:26

But that's not my forte and and I grew up working in kitchens and professional kitchens and that, and so my strength doesn't rely in or lie within a carpentry, even though my father was a mechanic and I found myself feeling a little bit hesitant to approach it because he was there with a couple other guys and all of them were trying to fix this pressure washer and there I was, standing on the outside looking in.

Speaker 1: 8:51

But I recognized that when it came down to the dinner hour and he needed a hand with preparing the steaks and making sure that they turned out well, he didn't lean over to his two buddies, he came over to me, and so when we can recognize that, just because we don't know how to fix something or we don't know how to do a certain thing that we may foresee or interpret being more masculine, that's really a story that we're telling ourselves. The other thing that came up with the Reddit question was being affectionate with people other than our partners and maybe even family members. You know, I remember, even not anymore than five or six years ago, just hugging a buddy. Six years ago, just hugging a buddy, you know, hey, man, great to see you, and giving him a hug was very unusual or not normal in our group and really in society.

Speaker 1: 9:40

But I think we find today that the expression of being able to hug your brothers, to know that and to tell them that you love them and understand that, comes from a place deep within. And so, as we become more comfortable with this and I've seen the toughest guys really break down when they get that recognition of truly being seen and loved, and I think that's so important that we recognize that being able to be affectionate that way is really an important way for us to express our emotions. Being a stay-at-home dad or earning less than our partners was another one that came up, and I can see that totally being a challenge, right, because we're supposed to be this breadwinner, right? I know there's lots of men's work out there that one of them that they like to really put forward is about being that provider. What does that provider look like? Sure, it can mean that, but provider can also be about being able to provide within the envelope of the home and if that makes sense for that couple, then I think that's what they need to lean into. And who are we to judge how that individual is living his life? Being open to our emotions I've been talking about that a lot already being content with good enough.

Speaker 1: 10:57

You know, one of the things that prevents us from doing things and I'll raise my hand to this one is this idea of perfectionism. So is it good enough? Should I launch this podcast? Should I launch this men's business? Should I step forward? And when I ask those questions, there's opportunity for me to say no, because it's just not good enough, and instead understanding that through growth comes those tribulations, those opportunities to stumble, even at the start of this podcast episode, a little bit of stumbling there until I start to get into a rhythm, and that's okay. It's okay for us to be able to practice that. And are we willing to lean into that in order to break this idea of who we are as men?

Speaker 1: 11:40

Taking a day off came up not fitting into or having an interest in manly hobbies or interests. I think that's a really interesting thing. Again, I think when we think about, you know, masculinity, lots of that has to do with, you know, working with our hands or building things or creating things. There's just different ways for us to express, and I don't think that having not having necessarily an interest in sports makes us less manly, or having an interest in less interest in carpentry, I'll do it. It's not the first thing that I would lean into, though. Getting a pedicure, I've noticed in the last few years, you know, the start of men taking care of themselves, the metrosexual man stepping forward, and now there's more and more barber shops that you know offering stuff for your beard and haircuts, and, yes, you can go in and enjoy a whiskey or cigar with your pedicure, and so we're taking something that wouldn't traditionally you wouldn't necessarily think of it as being a masculine but giving an opportunity for men to get together, and why shouldn't we take care of our bodies and ourselves, and so I really like that. That one came up and, of course, the last one that I noted was asking for help, and that's probably the biggest one we have to just destroy, as men is really looking at. Stop being that lone wolf and asking for some more help.

Speaker 1: 13:08

The mental health foundation reports that society's expectations around masculinity can make them feel less likely to talk about their feelings and to seek help for mental health problems, and that was found in 2020. What's something else we need to be aware of as we think about this idea of having mental challenges with our mental health, and it's the impact that it has on our relationships, and so stigma not only affects the individual, but it also affects our relationships, doesn't it? And so men who choose to suppress their emotions are going to struggle with communication and emotional intimacy in their relationships, and I can say one thing that I know that I work on really hard with our groups is to teach them how to increase their intimacy through conversation, and intimacy is all about being vulnerable enough to share what is on our heart, and trusting the person you're sharing this with will respect its presence. Now, that takes a while to do, and I would recommend and I do recommend for those that participate in our group mentoring program, the band of brothers is, if you struggle in your relationship to speak with your wife or your girlfriend and to really start sharing things, I would recommend not taking the biggest thing that you're trying to deal with and instead start with something smaller, much smaller, something that doesn't tip the scale one way or another in terms of the relationship once.

Speaker 1: 14:34

There's a thing that lawyers like to say is that you know, once the once the bell is rung, it cannot be unrung, and so what that goes to say is we want to be mindful of being able to have some practice before leaning into some of the more challenging conversations we're going to have about what's going on for us, and so I encourage men to use groups like men's group to get an opportunity to practice the things that are important, the things that are on your heart that you would like to share and maybe not everything that you'd like to share should be shared, and that might be a tough pill for some of my listeners to hear, but the truth of the matter is is that you can't unring the bell, and so you want to make sure you're in a safe space. Do you understand the impact of what you're sharing and what the long-term effects of that will be? And here's the other side and it's a real kicker for us if we're not paying attention is that women are not always ready to receive this kind of intimacy. If you're the kind of guy that never talks about his stuff and now you're at a point you're doing some work for yourself or on yourself and you want to lean into it, yes, they're willing to hear what you have to say, but hearing and listening is totally another story, and so it goes back to this ingrained cultural norm of what it means to be a man, and so it's why I really suggest that for men's group to practice us, with us on what it is that you wish to share. The fact of the matter is she may be unprepared to do that, and so that would require for her to do some work. The way you can do that is by practicing and learning how to do that, and so I talked I've been talking around this piece, and really this communication strategy that I share with men we work with is about these five levels of intimacy, and so most of the time for us guys, we like to stay in the safe zone, and that safe zone is where we just share some facts and information about things that we know.

Speaker 1: 16:32

And why do we do that? Well, it keeps us out of the harm's way, and we're just sharing stuff. And so the next level of it and it's pretty close is really sharing other people's opinions and beliefs, and so, yeah, I really like what Jordan Peterson had to say, because this is what he feels about masculinity and stoicism. Well, that's Jordan's opinion and belief, and you're just saying, yeah, I agree with that, but it also gives you an opportunity to step away from it, doesn't it? So that next level, that third level. Now we're going to really start to dive into things, and that's that personal opinion and beliefs. It's about really taking some small risks, so we still have room to change our mind if we want to avoid conflict.

Speaker 1: 17:12

And so this is a challenge for many men to get into to be able to share some opinions. And those of us that do share opinions maybe we share it from the perspective of that our give a shit factor is pretty low. Opinions Maybe we share it from the perspective of that our give a shit factor is pretty low. That can be dangerous as well, because what you're saying is that you're sharing but you're not really sharing because you're closed off to the feedback. You're closed off to hearing potentially a conflict that doesn't agree or a different perspective that doesn't agree with what you've just shared.

Speaker 1: 17:40

And so when we start to talk about how something has affected us, the experience that we're feeling within this, then we're being much more vulnerable, and because we can't change how we feel about something, right, if we sense that there's rejection or criticism, we might try to convince this other person and that you're no longer impacted about what had happened. And so this is why I say if you have something that's on your heart and it's been bothering you and it's been a challenge, it's been a part that really has caused some friction in your relationships. It's probably not the first thing you want to talk about, because your partner, your friend or whoever it is that you're wanting to share this with, who is attached to it, may not be able to see that you have changed. And, of course, the highest level of emotional intimacy that we can feel with another individual is expressing our needs and our emotions and our desires. And this is really about taking the heart out of our chest and putting it on the table, and you have to have a deep level of trust to do this, because once it's out on the table and you have to have a deep level of trust to do this because once it's out on the table, you can't unring the bell and so is there enough trust built and that can take a little while for us to get there, but it's important because if, men, if we don't do this work, if we continue to carry it, it's going to show up in our life and health issues. It's going to show up with not just mental health but physical health ailments.

Speaker 1: 19:04

There's an idea of there's dis-ease that comes upon us because of how we're carrying all of this burden, and so the Journal of Health and Social Behavior highlights that men who adhere to traditional masculine norms often experience more interpersonal conflict and have lower relationship satisfaction. And so what can we do to change some of those things? And we just went through a little bit of an exercise. What else can we consider about stigma and really breaking this thing down? Well, as entrepreneurs and executives, we often deal with intense stress, long hours and the pressure to succeed, and so these factors can lead to anxiety, depression and burnout, and so it's vital for us to recognize these signs early so we can take some proactive steps to address them. And so here are some key points I want to pass with you about how we can manage and deal with some of these things I just mentioned. So, when we think about high stress levels, you know the demands of running a business or managing a team can lead to chronic stress, and so one in 10 men experience depression and anxiety. That's a significant number of men, for sure. Mental health conditions, and so it includes different anxiety disorders and depression, and so we need to recognize when this is happening so that we can start to take action Work-life imbalance right.

Speaker 1: 20:30

As we live in a high-pressure society to always be succeeding and moving the needle forward, our roles tend to struggle to balance between our professional lives, the things that we're trying to accomplish in our lives, and our personal lives, and so it can lead to not just burnout but really strained relationships. And so many men work long hours, and that was my story for sure in my 20s and early 30s, as I was striving to be the best chef I could be and, yes, I had great success at the Culinary Olympics. But in the end, to what end? It cost me my family, it cost me my marriage, it cost me virtually everything. And so if I had an opportunity to do it over again, I would still want to be part of that culinary team and compete and be with that group of high-powered men, but I would also want to recognize the support and the backing that I needed from my family to truly make sure that I was present and available for them.

Speaker 1: 21:29

And so the other thing that will happen for us as we look at these different conditions is that we'll tend to, as mental health issues start to come up for us, we'll tend to isolate ourselves, and so the responsibility of us being leaders can be really isolating, and when you're leading a large group of individuals or you're leading an organization, you're trying to take it to that next level. There aren't a lot of people that you can go and relate to, and so it can lead us without much of a support network so we can share our struggles. And again I think this comes into play, this lone wolf syndrome, right. And so lots of reports are coming out that male loneliness and isolation is an epidemic, and it creates harm to men, as much harm to men as smoking 15 cigarettes a day, and I read that I was like, wow, man, that's pretty intense.

Speaker 1: 22:20

And so it does go back to some societal norms, these ideas, these beliefs, these values that we've lived by that cause us to have this kind of isolation, and so we need to be strong, self-sufficient, independent yes, we need to do that, and they're all great virtues, but not to a fault. And so that's where balance comes back into play. So how do we get to be the lone wolf? That's where balance comes back into play. So how do we get to be the lone wolf? Well, this shows up quite simply by us normally putting ourselves last. So if you catch yourself doing that, you might be in that lone wolf situation. I talked earlier about not feeling our feelings right. I don't need to feel that.

Speaker 1: 22:58

We'll deal with that later and when we come across with life like that, we will struggle as men, and of course there's financial pressure as well, and so when financial instability and the pressure to ensure our business is a success can truly exaggerate our stress and our anxiety. If we're not bringing home the baking, then what's happening to us? There's a lack of finances. These can cause us arguments, man. This just resonates with me so much. In my late 20s and early 30s, you know, there's this pressure that we need to provide and spending less time with our family. It brings on feelings that I didn't recognize until later, but they were feelings of shame and guilt and anxiety because we're not meeting expectations of ourselves and where we pick those up from which is from society and from other areas. And so this social competition, as some men strive to keep up with the Joneses, can really be detrimental to our lives. And I remember having some men in the group and that was something that he was sharing with us, that it was something that he knew he needed to deal with from having to be always wanting to be up with the Joneses, or maybe just a little bit better. And that's fine when everything is working great around you, but when one block of the Jenga puzzle comes out, then the entire construction falls down and really got to be mindful of that. So let me tell you a story about a friend of mine. His name is John. He was a successful entrepreneur. He went through a profound mental health journey and, see, john was always the epitome of success. He had built a thriving tech startup from the ground up and was a devoted husband and a father of two. On the surface, he seemed to have it all. However, behind the scenes, john was struggling immensely. The pressures of running a company and meeting investors' expectations and maintaining a happy family life just became overwhelming for him. It all began with just small signs, just little things that we tend not to pay attention to, and so John started to feel constantly being exhausted, and even after a full night's sleep, he just found himself being irritable over the littlest things, both at work and at home. His irritability continued to increase and increase, and so his productivity got worse and he started to miss important deadlines. Despite everything that his wife would say and her concerns over it, john it off.

Speaker 1: 25:20

As months passed, the situation only got worse for John. John began to experience some panic attacks before the major any major meeting. It didn't matter if that major meeting was at home or he's going to deal with something with his wife. We felt this persistent, intense feeling of dread and found it increasingly difficult to focus. He isolated himself from family and from friends, believing if he just needed to figure it out all on his own. And that stigma around the mental health made him fear that admitting and if he admits that he's struggling then he'd be seen as weak and would damage his reputation as a strong leader.

Speaker 1: 25:59

And one evening, after a particularly grueling day, john had a breakdown and he realized he couldn't be this way and that he needed help. It was a difficult decision, but he confided in his wife and everything he had been experiencing. They looked for support and understanding, for a turning point for him, encouraged by his wife and yes, john took a big risk by stepping in and speaking to his wife. John decided to seek some help, and so he did some help through not just professional help, through seeing a therapist, but he also looked for a men's group so that he could help and understand and recognize and manage what these stressors are, these triggers that were happening, and so he was introduced to concepts like mindfulness and meditation. It helped him to stay grounded and present. John not just did that, but in part of his men's group he also found some solace because with coming into a men's group he was able to share his experiences with others who really understood what his challenges were. That sense of community and mutual support was totally invaluable. He realized that he isn't the only guy struggling with this and that seeking help was a sign of strength, not weakness, for John.

Speaker 1: 27:09

He gradually began to implement some different changes in his life. He started to set some clear boundaries Geez, I wish I would have recognized that 25, 30 years ago between work and personal time and really ensuring that he spent time, quality time with his family. Because, let's face it, work-life balance isn't about having equal time with each other, but it's also it's really about understanding having the quality of time, of where it counts and when it counts. And so he just started to make changes at work, delegating responsibilities, trusting teen handle tasks. So that just started to make changes at work, delegating responsibilities, trusting teen handle tasks that he used to take on just for himself. And not only did it reduce his stress, but his employees, surprisingly enough, felt empowered. They could do more and be more for him. So over time, yes, his mental health did improve significantly and he became an advocate for it, and so he openly shares his journey with his peers. Now the nice thing about John is that John has become a great mentor to many others, and who would have thought, I'm sure John didn't think that that would be the outcome for him going through his struggles?

Speaker 1: 28:12

It's a powerful reminder for us to say that it's okay for us to struggle, it's okay to ask for help, and taking care of your mental health doesn't make you less capable. It makes you stronger and much more resilient. And so I want to talk a little bit about some practical tips that you can use to foster and help and benefit your mental health. And so no-brainer here, but regular exercise. You know that physical activity can help boost our mood and it helps reduce stress. We need to get rid of some of that stress in our body.

Speaker 1: 28:47

We've already mentioned mindfulness and meditation. It was something that I started to pick up on a few years back, and I do find the days that I am on it. I can tell you, the days that I do commit to doing at least 20 minutes of mindfulness and meditation, that those days tend to be the most productive days and the most centered days for me. Again, managing healthy work-life balance. It's about really understanding when you're on and when you're going to be off of your work piece, and when you're truly off, then you need to really be engaged with family and, of course, seeking professional help, and while those are great things and there's help for everybody at some level, depending on where you're at, professional help is the place for you. Of course, I'm going to recommend that joining a men's group and being around other men helps us define ourselves, helps us really to uncouple some things that have been, that are no longer serving us, some values and some beliefs that are no longer serving us. So joining a men's group is so key for us, and so there's lots of different resources available out there for you to help you on this journey, and from therapy to support groups and online resources.

Speaker 1: 29:58

As I mentioned earlier, the Band of Brothers it's our group mentoring program and it's an important thing that you take that first step, and so, as we wrap up today's episode, it's important to remember that breaking the stigma around men's mental health is a crucial step toward overcoming our well-being and acknowledging that it's okay to have struggles and seeking the sign of strength is not weakness. And so, as we discussed how societal norms and fears of judgment often prevent us from addressing our mental health issues, it's really essential that we recognize these challenges are common and that seeking support can lead to significant improvements in our quality of life as men. And so take some proactive steps. By talking about your feelings, by reaching out to professionals, by utilizing your resources can make a really huge difference in our lives. And so remember, mental health is just as important as our physical health. Taking care of it is a vital success to happiness.

Speaker 1: 30:55

And so I just want to close by saying, in summary don't let stigma hold us back. Prioritize your mental health, gentlemen, seek the support you need and encourage others to do the same. Brothers, we're all in this together, striving to the best version of ourselves. Thank you for tuning in to the Revolutionary man podcast. I hope you enjoyed today's conversation and it was insightful and empowering for you. So join us next week for part two, when we talk about men's mental health series. We're going to navigate the shadows about managing anxiety and depression, and so don't forget to subscribe, leave a review and share this podcast so that might benefit from it as well, and so, until until next time, take care of yourselves, my brothers Aho.

Speaker 2: 31:47

Thank you for listening to the Revolutionary man podcast. Are you ready to own your destiny, to become more the man you're destined to be? Join the brotherhood that is the Awakened man at theawakenedmannet and start forging a new destiny today.